Single v Double events

Munchkin · Post by **Munchkin** » Tue Nov 23, 2010 9:35 am

Thanks to whoever put the break down of event attendances over the past year.

Interestingly it doesn't seem to support the much used arguement that there is a higher attendance at double events... Singles at the Trwerwyn and Tully attracted more than the average number of competitors.

Admittedly the highest attended event (Washburn) was a double and the lowest attended event (Shepperton) was a single, but looking at the figures over the years Washburn seems to attract more and Shepperton fewer people (even as a double) than average.

I wonder if that is because of other factors than single v double events eg location, time of year (weather, more people fighting for promotion by the time Washburn comes around, people have got back into training), popularity of venue...

Carlr · Post by **Carlr** » Tue Nov 23, 2010 11:51 am

[QUOTE Admittedly the highest attended event (Washburn) was a double and the lowest attended event (Shepperton) was a single, but looking at the figures over the years Washburn seems to attract more and Shepperton fewer people (even as a double) than average.]

Could that be because Washburn is flat and fast running water and Sheps being a bit unreliable with water but big when levels are good!!! again maybe people picking easier slaloms.

Munchkin · Post by **Munchkin** » Tue Nov 23, 2010 12:03 pm

Carlr wrote:Could that be because Washburn is flat and fast running water and Sheps being a bit unreliable with water but big when levels are good!!! again maybe people picking easier slaloms.

Possibly, that comes under "popularity of venues" in my later paragraph me thinks...

djberriman · Post by **djberriman** » Tue Nov 23, 2010 1:53 pm

I don't think anyone has ever argued that there is much higher attendance at doubles.

What I have seen said is that people would be prepared to attend events if they were doubles or will not attend events (such as Llandysul) if they become singles.

As you mention I think there are many factors to take into account.

It will be interesting to see what happens to those events that have been changed to a single day like Llandysul.

Fup Duck · Post by **Fup Duck** » Tue Nov 23, 2010 2:24 pm

Why wait to see what happens, I previously suggested a straw poll and can't see, that whilst it might not change anything, it might be a good indicator of intention.

Munchkin · Post by **Munchkin** » Tue Nov 23, 2010 3:18 pm

Fup Duck wrote:Why wait to see what happens, I previously suggested a straw poll and can't see, that whilst it might not change anything, it might be a good indicator of intention.

Except that there are very few people that actually respond on this board and generally are not reflective of the wider slalom population...?

djberriman · Post by **djberriman** » Tue Nov 23, 2010 4:02 pm

Exactly my thoughts Munchkin (not many people respond and not reflective....). I think you are right there.

Sadly I know many people do not post here or have stopped because of the reaction they get when they do. Its hard to have a discussion on here without people getting upset.

I do however know a number of people have stated that they will not/probably will not attend Llandysul next year due to it being a one dayer, that said minds might change once it gets close to the date. Whether it affects numbers greatly remains to be seen.

Fup Duck · Post by **Fup Duck** » Tue Nov 23, 2010 9:58 pm

All fair points.

I don't even know that it would be worth it anyway, just a suggestion though. I'm sure there are other ways to do this - via clubs.....does it actually matter what people think?

People do seem to lose it here, I've read a few and thought bloody #### what's that about

Seedy Paddler · Post by **Seedy Paddler** » Wed Nov 24, 2010 12:17 pm

Be careful in using this data as it does not highlight all "Multiple" events.

For example the single at Tully is tied to a Pan Celtic which provides a meaningful weekend of paddling. Oters are combined Prem/Div 1s where a judging run is on a high standard of course and provides a weekend of productive paddling.

So quite different to driving considerable distance for a single day event!

CD

Munchkin · Post by **Munchkin** » Wed Nov 24, 2010 12:30 pm

But the single at Llandysul is to be joined with the J/ V champs and would still be suitable for judging (or a meaningful weekend if you are a J or V). A single 1 at Shepperton would probably be lined to a single 2, therefore valuable judging again...

Is it really any different???

Flyhigh3 · Post by **Flyhigh3** » Wed Nov 24, 2010 1:43 pm

We are more likely to go to Tully 1 (4-5hrs) as it has the Pan Celtic, and the Washburn 1 as it is a double (and 2 hrs), than a Shepperton 1 with a div2 (5 hrs), but we would go to Serpent's as a Prem/1 even though it is further for us (7 hrs), or a nearer 1/2 for us like HPP (3.5 hrs). We didn't go to Llandysul as a double Div 1/2 (and 8+ hrs!) and would be even less likely to go as a single 1, but MAY go this year as linked to J/V champs (by taking a day off...)
.
So, for us, it is a combination of distance, attraction of the water, opportunity to race on both days and gain points, or enter and train/judge on a 'one UP' (likie a Prem/1, or be part of a key event like Pan Celtic or J/V champs)

So I guess it also depends if you are a Prem, Div 1 or Div 2, or in those key events.... a Shep 1/2 may be good for those nearer Div 2s wanting a '1 up' but less attractive for a Div 1 paddler who is further away ...
But I expect others have their own combinations about why they would attend/not attend....... plus external factors

BUT overall, I am in favour of more or the same no of events, NOT less ...and in favour of doubles over singles where this is possible

Dee · Post by **Dee** » Fri Nov 26, 2010 4:52 pm

Div linked to prem is more appealing to many than div 1 linked to div 2, so yes, I think there is a difference - Div 1s usually more keen to judge at prems than div 2s.

Numbers at Shepperton were much higher for doubles than they were for singles if we compare different years which I think shows that doubles are more popular.

Events will be popular/less popular for all sorts of reasons, not all of them directly connected to slalom. Eg I like the Washburn because I get to stay at my favourite hotel! HPP at the end of May is the start of 1/2 term so fits in nicely with school. Central locations will be get higher numbers because more people will feel the distance is viable.

Shepperton used to suffer because by the time the year books came out it was too late to get the entries in on time. Fortunately the more widespread use of the internet has reduced this problem and the year book comes out more promptly these days thanks to jim and co.