entry fees - discounts

woza · Post by **woza** » Mon May 15, 2006 4:40 pm

how come there is a discount for multi class entries however when two people from the same family want to enter they have to pay full price for both entries, afterall they are still only filling two time slots in the race. i think that there should be some sort of familie discount. especially in the higher divisions were it has many a time cost families well over £50 just on entry fees. i think there should be some sort of familie discount ran in conjuction with the multiclass discount. what does does everyone else think?

Geebs · Post by **Geebs** » Tue May 16, 2006 12:33 am

I would not argue against that idea as I have three daughters that compete.

It is getting rather expensive now when you start adding up a total event cost for a race especialy when you have a single Div1/2 race at places like Tully or Bala or even two Div1 events on consequitive weekends at HPP

dsamartin · Post by **dsamartin** » Tue May 16, 2006 1:16 am

I totally agree,
Why are reduced entry fees for juniors available up to div 2 and no further?
It appears that at least 60-70% of those promoted from div 2 to div 1 already this year are juniors, it is difficult enough to fianance the fuel and accomodation costs without almost doubling the entry fees!!

??? ???

jim croft · Post by **jim croft** » Tue May 16, 2006 8:04 am

??? Entry fees are set at the ACM if you are not happy then you should get your club to put a motion to the next ACM, then all the clubs in attendance can have a say and vote. Motions should be sent to either the Slalom Administrator or the Hon Secretary all addresses are in the 2006 Slalom Yearbook withe deadlines for motions.

Jim

Geebs · Post by **Geebs** » Tue May 16, 2006 10:27 am

dsamartin wrote:I totally agree,
Why are reduced entry fees for juniors available up to div 2 and no further?
It appears that at least 60-70% of those promoted from div 2 to div 1 already this year are juniors, it is difficult enough to fianance the fuel and accomodation costs without almost doubling the entry fees!!

??? ???

We have been down this route before and I totally agree with what you say.

The answer we received is that there is increased costs in running a Div1 as in most cases you have electronic timing and section judges etc.

I do not think that European Law accepts this as a viable excuse though!

But as Jim says it will have to be brought up at the ACM proposed as a motion by a club.

Dave Royle · Post by **Dave Royle** » Tue May 16, 2006 10:47 pm

I don't see why we have reduced fees for Juniors at all. It should be the Vets that get reduced fees in order to try and keep the old gits paddling.

It does seems reasonable to charge more for Prem and Div 1 when they do have section judges and timing to pay expenses for. What has European law have to do with it?

The reduction for families is reduced petrol per head.

Perhaps we should charge people based on time on the course. Fastest time = free. Slowest time = really expensive. On a more selfish note please ignore this stupid idea.

oldandslow · Post by **oldandslow** » Tue May 16, 2006 11:22 pm

Slowest time = really expensive.

That idea would certainly make me go faster!

Geebs · Post by **Geebs** » Wed May 17, 2006 12:03 am

Dave Royle wrote:I don't see why we have reduced fees for Juniors at all. It should be the Vets that get reduced fees in order to try and keep the old gits paddling.

It does seems reasonable to charge more for Prem and Div 1 when they do have section judges and timing to pay expenses for. What has European law have to do with it?

The reduction for families is reduced petrol per head.

Perhaps we should charge people based on time on the course. Fastest time = free. Slowest time = really expensive. On a more selfish note please ignore this stupid idea.

So why do we have them in every other division other than Prem & Div1?

I'm sure people would be quite happy to pay less and not bother with the nice Beep when you start and finish and just have gate judges on the bank.

I think you will find that European law has a lot to do with equality and is certainly very strong regarding Human Rights and encouraging juniors.

Reduced petrol per head,,, Hmmmm better idea reduced entry fees for multiple entries as petrol prices are going up and people will not make the long trips!

Canadian Paddler · Post by **Canadian Paddler** » Wed May 17, 2006 8:07 am

On the substansive topic, the original isea was to encourage people to try other classes, by the time you get to div 1, it was thought that you did not need encouraging, you had made some commitment. (or if you are DV need commiting anyway), so no discount
I may be slow, but I am not sure how a family discount would provide encouragement to grow the base of the sport.

As for junior discounts above div 2, I cannot remember there ever being discount at that level, (but that may just be senility), so it is a valid thing to question the resaons, status quo is not good enough.

Despite Dave's posting being light hearted, a DV discount might help keep people in the sport and paddling at events, providing a base level in each division to keep the standards up, but looking at the lower divisions, the snior age group is the smallest, so perhaps we need a discount to keep seniors.

OR - <falem prrof trousers on>, why not remove the junior discount altogether and reduce general entry fees in line. After all, juniors take up the same time on the water, need the same amount of admin AND get more prizes than the seniors who pay larger entry fees.

Like Dave I can not see the link with European laws, but have not investigated.

Anne · Post by **Anne** » Wed May 17, 2006 9:21 am

I can understand some of the arguments here, I had x2 juniors racing but it never crossed my mind to ask for reductions for juniors at Div 1 & Prem - actually I was in a way happy to pay - they were totally committed to a sport we all enjoyed and became our way of life, they were fit and healthy, didn't get into the smoking cult and were off the streets. A small price to pay for getting through the teenage years without to much trauma!!

Would have done it again for daughter if she wanted - but not interested in canoeing hence the horse!! (even more expensive and again no difference in entry fees for shows etc)

On another thread if we reduced fees for what would amount to a large proportion of competitors where does the lost income for both the clubs and the Slalom Committee come from??? Increases all round???!!! Course hire etc at higher levels costs the same whatever the age.

However if a motion was put to the ACM it would certainly be discussed and voted on.

chauffeur · Post by **chauffeur** » Wed May 17, 2006 9:47 am

If you add up 2 juniors x a double event weekend = £58 (and that is if one of them doesn't C1 as well as K1!)
Caravan/camping Fri/Saturday = anything from £16 to £40
Diesel (we especially changed to diesel to get more miles to the gallon) = £30 or more
Not added food costs, as you have to eat anyway
We reckon a £100 for a weekend.
We spend the money because it is a great sport for them and they love it, plus they get so much from it.
However, the cost means it is not an 'inclusive' sport if you are having to count the pennies. 'Sport for All' is a well known slogan and I am not sure the costs allow this to happen for some families. ???

Kev.S · Post by **Kev.S** » Wed May 17, 2006 12:37 pm

chauffeur, I agree with you, I have three kids paddling, you have not taken into account training 2-3 time a week at HPP the travelling costs and water fees, the ordinary joe could not afford our sport, I reckon on around £150.00 a week.

And yes Anne it does keep the kids off the streets, but sport for all it certainly is not.

Hey CP any chance of a family discount Sunday? :p

woza · Post by **woza** » Wed May 17, 2006 6:49 pm

wow, didnt think id kick up this much of a stink. however i still strongly stand by my opinion that there should be some sort of familie discount, however i think some of the earlier posts misunderstood what i was trying to say. a family discount would encourage paddlers from all agegroups and throughoutthe devisions not just a single age band but everyone.

ok this might not encourage thousands more people to take up slalom however it would encourage those already doing slalom to go to more evnts. i am very greatful that this issue shall be braught up at the nex ACM however this means that we have to wait untill the end of thsi year before the issue is looked at officialy.

i can also apprietiate that some people dont mind paying the fees as it helps the organisers etc. however, with a reduction more people could afford to go to more events thus canceling this problem out as the organisers would have more entries to cover the costs.

this would make the sport allot more enjoyable as there would be more competiton and people wouldnt have to worrie about 'counting the pennies' as much. further more thanks to everybody who has agreed with me so far.

jim croft · Post by **jim croft** » Thu May 18, 2006 10:57 am

??? Qoute by Woza:- "i am very greatful that this issue shall be braught up at the nex ACM however this means that we have to wait untill the end of thsi year before the issue is looked at officialy."

Be warned the issue will only come up at the ACM if it is proposed and seconded by a club/s

Jim

Canadian Paddler · Post by **Canadian Paddler** » Thu May 18, 2006 2:38 pm

Kev, As a special offer, you can have a 50% discount on all officials entries. . . .

We will of course have to penalise you with an extra 25% due to you offering false information on the size of TUTTI

ADVERT We are, of course talking about THE event of the forthcoming weekend, the Orton Mere slalom in Peterborough!

Roll up, Roll up, see the weir featured in Octopussy and battle the 'raging' torrent. Gasp in amazement at the club ashes, and say rude things about the arsonists. Be amazed that young prize winners can manage to carry the loads of 'stuff' they get as prizes, and at the sheer number of prize winners. Enjoy the canteen, mixing freshly cooked food, commercial sweets and home made muffins, fruit cake etc. Laugh at the pathetic attempts of the organiser to get his hands on your money, then recoil in amazement that it actually worked!

Enjoy yourself safe in the knowledge that your tent can be as close as 40 yards from the start line.

OR to put it another way, just come along and have a good time. Course up tomorrow morning, then free practice.

In all seriousness, ranking entry fees are set at the AGM, and just administering the multi class discounts is a nightmare for Jim. Let alone trying to sort out family discounts when Dad is Mr Smith, Mum is Ms Jones and the kids (from two previous marriages are Smyth and Bloggins!

We seem to have a flaming urgent need for cash at the moment, so I want your money - where is your C2 entry???? or are you kayaking this weekend? (or both)

I will talk to the other club officers, and might be able to go to something from the canteen for each family, of course the size of the family and number of paying entries is yet to be agreed. . .

Remember we charge per PADDLER, not per person on teh campsite, so there is a small reduction.