Does your canoe club have its own slalom boats? - So that juniors can try before they buy

The place to discuss slalom development issues specific to England
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Does your canoe club have its own slalom boats? - So that juniors can try before they buy

Yes - we have plenty of slalom boats within our club for juniors to use
5
38%
Yes - but there aren't enough to go around
8
62%
No - our club has not done slalom before
0
No votes
 
Total votes: 13

Mark Shaw
Posts: 166
Joined: Wed Jun 25, 2008 11:13 pm
Location: Lancaster

Post by Mark Shaw » Sat Jun 28, 2008 5:48 pm

There are plenty of second hand slalom boats and equipment available that can be purchased fairly cheaply by canoe clubs to encourage the development of slalom.

There are also grants available that can be used to purchase new slalom boats for those clubs that can demonstrate a commitment to junior development.

P.S. Can you please post a reply when you vote so that I know which clubs/individuals have responded to the poll?
The above is the personal opinion of Mark Shaw and does not reflect the views of either the BCU or England Slalom Committees.

Nicky
Posts: 192
Joined: Wed Jun 06, 2007 12:53 pm
Location: Darlington

Post by Nicky » Sun Jun 29, 2008 5:55 pm

Again, St Albans has a few old wrecks, and generally manage with people in the club lending boats to the nippers for the odd session

dsamartin
Posts: 26
Joined: Tue Aug 16, 2005 9:31 pm

Post by dsamartin » Sun Jun 29, 2008 10:44 pm

The North East region have 6 slalom kayaks for use between 15-20 clubs--It is obvious that this number is inadequate to meet the demands of the region. We need to purchase more-not neccessarily new boats- for use at both club and regional events.

c1champ
Posts: 46
Joined: Mon Nov 05, 2007 11:24 am
Location: england

Post by c1champ » Mon Jun 30, 2008 1:25 pm

Matlock canoe club has about 8-9 slalom boat for juniors or adults to use. These are available for all club members to try before they go and spend lots of money on a new boat.

Steve Hawkins Matlock C.C

Munchkin
Posts: 535
Joined: Mon Nov 19, 2007 9:22 am
Location: Hertfordshire

Post by Munchkin » Tue Jul 01, 2008 5:01 pm

Baldock and District Canoe Club have a large K1 and a small K1 for people to borrow. Both are brand new so should be in good condition (thanks Cool Blue Canoes). They were obtained from funds from a Local Organisation (Letchworth Heritage Foundation).

We also have an old K1 (large), an old C2 (a sieve) and an old C1 (ouch!). Hopefully we can replace the C's with more funding next year.

We are technically an adult's only club but have some juniors that belong to the adults!

jke
Posts: 119
Joined: Mon Oct 24, 2005 7:33 pm

Post by jke » Fri Jul 04, 2008 1:23 pm

Mark Shaw wrote:There are plenty of second hand slalom boats and equipment available that can be purchased fairly cheaply by canoe clubs to encourage the development of slalom.

I don't believe this is the case, certainly not modern 3.5m boats. Maybe it's because we're not a strong slalom club where kit can be offloaded down the food chain as it were.

Mark Shaw wrote:There are also grants available that can be used to purchase new slalom boats for those clubs that can demonstrate a commitment to junior development.

I don't agree with this either, certainly not in the South West region. I made an unsuccessful attempt a couple of years ago. I'm not at my home PC at the moment so can't remember the detail. I think it was partly due to the fact that we didn't have Top Club, only working towards it.

We have no where near enough slalom boats, particularly modern designs, and I think the sport has got to the point where 4m boats are not particularly helpful. We have a number of old boats which we share around. We now have two new junior boats, paid for largely from local donations.

The deficit is made up from plastic river boats.

At our own Langham Farm Slalom, over the two days a total of 25 club members took part. We shared slalom boats, used plastic, and were fortunate to have Cool Blue Canoes demo boats.

John Kent
Frome Canoe Club

Edit: Just seen the subtitle "so that juniors can try before they buy". I am focussing on the club getting more slalom boats. I would be uneasy at the moment if juniors were to want their own slalom boats because due to the lack of close events, slalom for us is a fragmented season, even though we do a certain amount of training all through the summer. Juniors, if they buy their own, get plastic river as their first boat.
John Kent

Mark Shaw
Posts: 166
Joined: Wed Jun 25, 2008 11:13 pm
Location: Lancaster

Post by Mark Shaw » Fri Jul 04, 2008 10:01 pm

Hi John,

Thanks for your other posts which I will hopefully persuade others to reply to, particularly on the coaching side of things.

3.5m boats are starting to become more plentiful although still a little pricey. They are mostly available at Div 1 events but that requires paddlers from your neck of the woods to travel large distances. More importantly they aren't always the best things for juniors to start in, as they can be quite difficult to handle until they have learnt the necessary skills.

Some clubs have gone out and purchased new slalom boats more appropriate for junior paddlers with grants provided but, as you point out, these clubs have obtained their Clubmark status first in order to access these grants. This is an area where hopefully we can help clubs aspiring to get their Clubmark status.

Which then leaves us with slightly older 3.6m or longer boats which need a bit of attention but are usually sold on at a reasonable price, but again you need to be attending Div 1/2 slalom events to pick them up.

I'm after some lateral thinking from this forum's membership about how we address this issue. There is the potential for Frome Canoe Club to state what its requirements are and to invite other canoe clubs/individuals to see if they can meet your requirments. This could be done today by posting in the Wanted section of this forum but I don't know how many people actively read that section. It tends to be pretty quiet because most paddlers pass on kit within their own clubs.

The 'try before you buy' comment was referring to the approach taken by some of the more active slalom clubs whereby they provide basic beginners boats whilst paddlers are in the early slalom divisions but are then expected to purchase their own boat by the time they are progressing in to Div 2. By this stage a paddler really needs their own boat if they are serious about the sport. If not, then hopefully there are enough juniors coming through the club behind them who would be keen to grab the club boat off them.

That way you then start to create your own supply and demand within your own club with higher division paddlers wanting to find buyers for their old 3.5m boat.

I've no easy answers but this is an area that we do need to address which is why I am keen to see some discussion on this topic.

Mark
The above is the personal opinion of Mark Shaw and does not reflect the views of either the BCU or England Slalom Committees.

Munchkin
Posts: 535
Joined: Mon Nov 19, 2007 9:22 am
Location: Hertfordshire

Post by Munchkin » Sat Jul 05, 2008 12:01 am

A good place to try is the Lottery. We have a full set of polo kit and some open Canadians and a trailer all obtained through the Lottery.

We are now looking at getting slalom kit through that route.

Frome may find it worth a try as it is actually easier if you have kids, miniority groups or disabled people in the club. We used links with DofE to strengthen our previous application.

Munchkin
Posts: 535
Joined: Mon Nov 19, 2007 9:22 am
Location: Hertfordshire

Post by Munchkin » Sat Jul 05, 2008 12:03 am

P.S what is the Clubmark status?

John Sturgess
Posts: 280
Joined: Thu May 27, 2004 12:01 am
Location: Gedling, Nottingham/Long Preston, North Yorkshire

Post by John Sturgess » Sun Jul 06, 2008 12:20 am

Clubmark is a SportEngland branding which you usually get alongside your own National Governing Body kitemark: so a Club that gets Top Club automatically gets Clubmark as well

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davebrads
Posts: 508
Joined: Tue May 25, 2004 7:43 am
Location: Tamworth
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Post by davebrads » Sun Jul 06, 2008 10:21 pm

We got a large grant last year to set up a junior slalom squad. I'm afraid that I am that lax that I don't know where it came from, but I could find out. I think it was some kind of locally distributed fund. It has pretty much given us enough boats, paddles etc. for the number of juniors we are currently able to provide coaching for. We have since raised some more money which we are spending on a couple more (smaller) boats, and some more paddles.

We are also in the process of collecting another sum of money from Nestle via their Easter Gift Certificate promotion, some of which is going to be spent on coach development, but some of it is marked for spending on secondhand adults boats.

The Junior Squad is developing very well, almost too fast. The money was available, and someone had to put some effort into obtaining it. The other requirements were: a team of coaches who were willing to give up some time on a regular basis; the facilities (which we already had, I know that we are lucky in that regard); and some juniors within the club who wanted something more.

We aren't clubmark accredited, although we are not a million miles away from obtaining Top Community Club. We thought we were close to gettng Top Performance Club, but they have recently tightened up the requirements and we find ourselves too far away to make it worth the effort, at least for the time being.

katonas
Posts: 321
Joined: Mon Jan 23, 2006 4:34 pm

Post by katonas » Thu Jul 24, 2008 9:45 pm

How would you vote if your club had one old 4m slalom boat that was impossible to turn, and used to do slalom?

Munchkin
Posts: 535
Joined: Mon Nov 19, 2007 9:22 am
Location: Hertfordshire

Post by Munchkin » Fri Jul 25, 2008 9:25 am

katonas wrote:How would you vote if your club had one old 4m slalom boat that was impossible to turn, and used to do slalom?
I would have said yes then put down a comment! Until a couple of months ago that, plus an antique C1 and a C2/ gaffa express was all we had.

Trudi
Posts: 8
Joined: Sun Oct 14, 2007 12:36 pm
Location: East Yorkshire

Post by Trudi » Sun Aug 17, 2008 7:53 pm

Hi All,
We at KKC are at the moment are putting forward a bid for Slalom Boats and Kit with the Youth grants that our local council run every year. So i suggest you ring your local coucil and see what they can offer. I will say that the bid has to be put in by the Kids and not by adults and other kids the youth coucil, say yes or no to the application. we are keeping our fingers crossed as we only have a few old boats (the days before you used foot rest to help you go forward) for our younger paddlers to use. The rest of the boats are member own, but we do let the kids use them.
Trudi

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Spiderman
Posts: 374
Joined: Mon Oct 18, 2004 11:20 pm
Location: Bedfordshire

Post by Spiderman » Wed Aug 27, 2008 12:37 pm

VKC is currently disposing of its 4m Club boats and replacing these with 3.5m variants. I have recently been given about £1000 of Club funds to obtain 2 or 3 second hand boats and my "wanted" ad is currently on this Forum :-)

I recently purchased Huw swetnums Caiman Ranger for a brilliant £300 and this was just under a year old. It did have a problem with flaking gel coat but it was watertight and obviously a top notch comp construction kayak! I decided to sell it to the Club for the same money and it is now assisting others on a weekly basis! many thanks Huw!

I would be very intereste din any grants for more boats as we will never have enough it seems. We have just that ONE 3.5m kayak at present and a big fight for it every week! But at least this highlighted the need and subsequently that is why the Club is now seeking more :-) So if you are reading this and wish to sell VKC a watertight 3.5m kayak for about £300......message me! :-)

So...about this grant....?
Peter Parker - 12 gate courses are plenty long enough!

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