Portable points next season

[Arrowcraft]

I saw the video for portable points...but how is this going to work next year?
Will there still be a divisional system? Etc.
Does anyone have the details?

[djberriman]

See http://giveitfish.co.uk/phpBB3/viewtopi ... 55&p=15929

[djberriman]

Major issue is I'm not aware of a lot happening and the submissions for events for next year is based upon it being implemented.

As well as major rule changes it affects all results systems and the ranking database.

One major feature being able to identify paddlers, thus there may be 2 bib 100's in a race, one from say div 1 and one from div 2, so although it won't be so much of an issue to the event itself (due to cards/bib colours etc) it will effect the ranking database trying to work out who is who, therefore all results in my opinion need a leading digit to denote which division the paddler belongs to.

It would be nice to see all the rule changes and other changes clarified/identified well before the ACM so there is chance to comment and iron out any issues.

Duncan

[BaldockBabe]

One major feature being able to identify paddlers, thus there may be 2 bib 100's in a race, one from say div 1 and one from div 2, so although it won't be so much of an issue to the event itself (due to cards/bib colours etc) it will effect the ranking database trying to work out who is who, therefore all results in my opinion need a leading digit to denote which division the paddler belongs to.

Hi Duncan,

You might want to speak to Andy about this at some point. We already have a system in place for P/1/2 events that the timing team are at as each paddler needs a unique identifying number for our system. It may be best to see if the numbers we use could be rolled out rather than having multiple systems?

[BaldockBabe]

Major issue is I'm not aware of a lot happening and the submissions for events for next year is based upon it being implemented.

It looks like I am going to have to put in a motion to open up the calendar again for a few weeks in the event that PP does not go thought (I hear rumblings of a rebellion against it). My plan would be to put in a motion to state that clubs with an event already on the calendar have x weeks to apply for those events to become double division events and thus the calendar at the ACM can only be "finalised" in respect of the events on the calendar at that point and not in respect of the addittional division.

[Arrowcraft]

Is there anyone actually in favour of the new system?

From the link above it seems that this is not popular within the sport.

It looks like the div 1 paddlers are going to compete with all the div 2 paddlers to get a race that only accepts half the division as it is. It does not apply to div 3 or Prem. So it basically prevents dive 3 / 2 races being joint events and forces div 3 paddlers to compete with div 2 paddlers for points and prizes that they are unlikely to win.m and allows div 1's to race at prem races...if they can get an entry.

I'd this about bight or am I missing something?

[Dee]

Is there anyone actually in favour of the new system?

From the link above it seems that this is not popular within the sport.

It looks like the div 1 paddlers are going to compete with all the div 2 paddlers to get a race that only accepts half the division as it is. It does not apply to div 3 or Prem. So it basically prevents dive 3 / 2 races being joint events and forces div 3 paddlers to compete with div 2 paddlers for points and prizes that they are unlikely to win.m and allows div 1's to race at prem races...if they can get an entry.

I'd this about bight or am I missing something?

I think you are missing something
Although the proposal was passed at the last ACM, I believe that much of the details of the actual rule changes were to be worked out this year. I haven't heard what they are though.

Regarding div 1/div 2. At the moment there are several events which are double divisions so div 1 paddlers do already compete with div 2s for places. If the proposals go ahead then all races will be single division, so div 1s will have priority at div 1 races and div 2s will only get the left over spaces. In practice this could ease the situation for div 1s (but make it worse for div 2s)

Prem will continue pretty much as it is now but with, I suspect, a greater number of div 1 paddlers applying for left over spaces to gain portable points (this could potentially ease the div 1/2 situation as the top end of div 1 may focus on prem races rather than their own division).

I think that most div 2 organisers would still look to give a first div 3 prize etc (and something like this could be incorporated into the rules)

The "devil is in the detail" as they say, and I just don't think there is enough detail.

PS. I'm fairly ambivalent as to whether this should go ahead. I can see benefits (especially for those who want to race on bigger water but don't have the speed to get promotion) but recognise potential dangers in the shake up.

[Arrowcraft]

I see. So basically there is no change except that paddle ups will get points for their position rather than all or nothing. They may get more than 1,000 points and can get less than this depending on their ranking position in the race. etc. Not sure this will help with the over subscribed races though.

What does the membership think? Have they been asked?

[BaldockBabe]

What does the membership think? Have they been asked?

It went to a vote at last year's ACM. The poposal can be found in the ACM minutes on the website http://www.canoeslalom.co.uk/committee/ ... inutes.pdf It was a close vote with a lot of abstensions.

[Nick Penfold]

Proposed details now published at http://www.canoeslalom.co.uk/committee/ ... points.htm

[Dee]

In a lot of ways I think the new rules seem simpler

[BaldockBabe]

My question is what are the "issues" that PP are supposed to be resolving? Without seeing what they are trying to achieve I am still stuck with the question of what is the point.

[suse]

Well it looks like all races will be single division which is a problem for us parents who take several kids in different divisions out and about. How is a newly promoted div 3 10 year old supposed to "paddle up" at the div 2 slaloms her sister paddles? And how are we supposed to find the money to go to div 3 events and div 2 events? Having 2/3 events was great as the more novice kids paddled in div 3 and the experienced div 2 kids get taken to the odd 1/2 to hone their skills whilst doing most competition at 2/3 events. Not happy

[Sven]

I agree with Baldockbabe, I'm struggling to see where the benefits are for portable points, and Suse is not alone in her concerns.

Can the architects of the scheme perhaps bring some clarity here?

[SilverSurfer]

My understanding is that you can't have a multi-class single event e.g. a Div 2/3, but you can have a Div 2 on Saturday and Div 3 on the Sunday of the same weekend, as they are separate events.

I guess it's all down to want the race organiser decides on.

As to portable points, love it or hate it, no one should be surprised by the change, it's been well documented for a very long time and all clubs had the opportunity to have their say/vote at the ACM last year.