Percentiles (for want of a better word)

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djberriman
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Joined: Tue Apr 03, 2007 8:19 pm

Percentiles (for want of a better word)

Post by djberriman » Wed Jan 23, 2019 12:52 pm

You may notice your individual bib record and the ranking list now shows 3 percentiles

Start of year percentile

This is your percentile as and when the rankings were created for the new year.

Current percentile

This is your percentile taking into account changes during the year. This includes paddlers being promoted in, promoted out, reinstatements, deranking, suspensions and of course race results. You may already see this is different to your start of year percentile due to reinstatements and deranking (movements to vets).

PU Percentile

This is displayed for clarity and shows the percentile that will be used for paddle up entries you may make. It will be the better of start of year percentile and when you have raced current percentile.

The paddle up percentile is used by Dee's system to determine the priority order for PU entries when they are processed rather than when the date the PU entry was made as per the ACM decision. This is to better reflect the original intention of PU to allow those near the top of a division to PU and gain experience the next division.

Dee
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Re: Percentiles (for want of a better word)

Post by Dee » Wed Jan 23, 2019 1:11 pm

djberriman wrote:
Wed Jan 23, 2019 12:52 pm
PU Percentile
This is displayed for clarity and shows the percentile that will be used for paddle up entries you may make. It will be the better of start of year percentile and when you have raced current percentile.
I thought that in the end it was agreed not to use 'best of', but to just use current percentile (as at end of priority period) unless the paddler hadn't raced, and then, and only then, use the start of year percentile?
Kit Washer, Entry Clerk, Chauffeur, Reluctant Organiser, Online Entry Advocate .....
Anything I post under this user is my personal opinion; I am not posting as a member of the Slalom Committee!

djberriman
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Joined: Tue Apr 03, 2007 8:19 pm

Re: Percentiles (for want of a better word)

Post by djberriman » Wed Jan 23, 2019 1:19 pm

I will check the minutes ......

djberriman
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Re: Percentiles (for want of a better word)

Post by djberriman » Wed Jan 23, 2019 1:22 pm

You are indeed correct Dee.

Ranking percentile is the current ranking position divided by the number in the division
rounded to a whole percentage. E.g. if there are 70 in the division, the 16th placed athlete will
be 16/70*100 = 22.85%, rounded to 23%. Where an athlete has not competed, the percentile
will be taken from the start of year ranking.

It will be so

Dee
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Re: Percentiles (for want of a better word)

Post by Dee » Wed Jan 23, 2019 1:26 pm

It's not exactly easy reading, is it :lol: :lol: :lol:
Kit Washer, Entry Clerk, Chauffeur, Reluctant Organiser, Online Entry Advocate .....
Anything I post under this user is my personal opinion; I am not posting as a member of the Slalom Committee!

djberriman
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Joined: Tue Apr 03, 2007 8:19 pm

Re: Percentiles (for want of a better word)

Post by djberriman » Wed Jan 23, 2019 1:31 pm

Now correct as per ACM (thanks Dee for pointing it out).

You may notice your individual bib record and the ranking list now shows 3 percentiles

Start of year percentile

This is your percentile as and when the rankings were created for the new year.

Current percentile

This is your percentile taking into account changes during the year. This includes paddlers being promoted in, promoted out, reinstatements, deranking, suspensions and of course race results. You may already see this is different to your start of year percentile due to reinstatements and deranking (movements to vets).

PU Percentile

This is set to your start of year percentile until you have raced at which point your current percentile will be used.

The paddle up percentile is used by Dee's system to determine the priority order for PU entries when they are processed rather than when the date the PU entry was made as per the ACM decision. This is to better reflect the original intention of PU to allow those near the top of a division to PU and gain experience the next division.

Steve Holmes
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Re: Percentiles (for want of a better word)

Post by Steve Holmes » Wed Jan 23, 2019 10:36 pm

Not wanting to throw a spanner in the works, but shouldn’t all those who finished last season as NRSS get the same percentile? At the moment those first alphabetically have a paddle up advantage over the Watsons and Wilkinsons.

Dee
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Re: Percentiles (for want of a better word)

Post by Dee » Wed Jan 23, 2019 11:39 pm

I think they all get a pu percentile of 100%?

I think the past seasons rankings are broken though?
Kit Washer, Entry Clerk, Chauffeur, Reluctant Organiser, Online Entry Advocate .....
Anything I post under this user is my personal opinion; I am not posting as a member of the Slalom Committee!

JimW
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Location: Pinkston

Re: Percentiles (for want of a better word)

Post by JimW » Thu Jan 24, 2019 12:32 pm

Vererans?
I guess it is easiest to apply the same formatting to all divisions?

djberriman
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Re: Percentiles (for want of a better word)

Post by djberriman » Thu Jan 24, 2019 10:15 pm

The percentiles are correct as it is based on their ranking position. The start of year calculation for this has not changed. If this needs changing feel free to bring a motion to the ACM but there is no provision in the rules for making them the same however valid that might be.

I would however doubt there will be many cases where an NRSS gets a first race as a paddle up (regardless of surname). If they race the first race of their division they will instantly have much more chance of getting a PU if they achieve a good result.

Nothing is perfect and there are always anomolies...

I'll fix previous seasons rankings tomorrow and perhaps remove the extra columns from vets (and indeed Prem). However you may want to use start of year and current to see how you are progressing.

Dee
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Re: Percentiles (for want of a better word)

Post by Dee » Thu Jan 24, 2019 10:43 pm

Don’t take Vets percentiles off back end though please as that might give me some issues!
Kit Washer, Entry Clerk, Chauffeur, Reluctant Organiser, Online Entry Advocate .....
Anything I post under this user is my personal opinion; I am not posting as a member of the Slalom Committee!

Steve Holmes
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Re: Percentiles (for want of a better word)

Post by Steve Holmes » Fri Jan 25, 2019 9:04 am

Good point Duncan, hadn’t thought about the actual reality of a recent promotee actually wanting to paddle up.

Dee
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Re: Percentiles (for want of a better word)

Post by Dee » Fri Jan 25, 2019 9:50 am

There will always be one.

One of the difficulties with online entries - and I am sure the ranking database or any other system, for that matter . - is not the average, bog standard entry, it's all the "special" cases and "one-offs" and the knowledge that if you don't handle something, because no-one would ever ... then you can guarantee that someone will. :twisted: :lol:
Kit Washer, Entry Clerk, Chauffeur, Reluctant Organiser, Online Entry Advocate .....
Anything I post under this user is my personal opinion; I am not posting as a member of the Slalom Committee!

djberriman
Posts: 806
Joined: Tue Apr 03, 2007 8:19 pm

Re: Percentiles (for want of a better word)

Post by djberriman » Fri Jan 25, 2019 8:52 pm

A newly promoted paddler may want to paddle up but the ACM change is designed to favour those at the top, to ensure the rapidly improving and close to promotion paddlers get a chance to paddle up.

It means there is little point applying for a PU months in advance as whether you get an entry will be determined on your performance to date compared to your division not when you entered. If you are outside the top 20-30% of the division I doubt you will get a PU.

There is of course nothing to stop you entering as a judge and ensuring you get a place.

Time will tell if it works......

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