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Posted: Fri Apr 21, 2006 4:51 pm
by Anne
The coaching support given to juniors now compared to pre world class is far greater and covers a much wider age band. I don't knw the exact numbers off the top of my head but there are certainly more than "a handful of teenagers" aupported.
Spreading it even thiner would most likely mean the goals at the end are not met which bluntly means - "no medals - no money"
Oh and yes they can move to Uni and Notts and still perform to their best, perhaps not all but most. Not easy and a financial burden on parents as they don't have the time to work as well as study and train!
Before World class approx 6 juniors from each class were selected for winter training, the honor of which you had to pay for, the other alternatives were a couple of England training week-ends, again paddlers had to pay for these and a development weekend put on by John Gregory, again at a cost. Otherwise it was work with your clubs or pay for a coach.
Ok it may not be perfect but it is FAR better than what we had before - I can vouch for that 1st hand!
We do apreciate all those paddlers who are there just to enjoy the racing, without them there wouldn't be a sport that won 2 medals at the last Olympics. We are concidering in the review as to how we can make everyones racing more rewarding. I personally have a great leaning to bringing back teams and running all prems as international format, but that is just a personal view that I will put forward as you all can when the time comes.
Posted: Fri Apr 21, 2006 7:03 pm
by guest
but what happens when someone gets into nottingham uni and everythings gone to broxbourne
Posted: Sun Apr 23, 2006 8:33 am
by Anne
Hopefully it will be a gradual transition and possibly not total as Broxbourne will be pumped therefore most likely not running 24/7. But it is something paddlers in the future will have to consider, as will World Class, remember they have partners with jobs in Nottingham and families who are settled, it won't be any easy decision to move lock, stock and barrel.
HPP will always be the best training site around as it does run 24/7 and gives the flexibility - and hopefully it will get even better - lots of exciting developments in the pipe line - watch this space!
Posted: Mon Apr 24, 2006 8:51 am
by Andy Greensmith
Thanks for your comments Dave, it feels good to know someone else see's the sport like me.
I'm not and have never (not in the last ten years) asked for coaching, i'm happy to just get on the water, have a little space and train. Stafford and Stone isn't quite what it looks like from the outside. Apart from a few fantastic people of whom i sincerely admire and will always class them as my team mates (they'll know who they are), there is no club as far as i'm concerned.
Over the last twelve months i've watched the junior paddlers develop, many are now beating me, which is great. What i don't like is the way that many of them act. The continual nasty coments to other paddlers including those in their own group which aren't performing. Its really turning into a cut throat sport for the up and comming. Even with all the extra money and coaching, i personally don't think i could hack going back to being a junior paddler.
I respect those that are now making the most of this boost in funds but does it have to be so pressured. Isn't this sport suppose to be fun as well?
What i was trying to say regarding those yougsters that quit is that at the point when they get dropped, they've never paddled with people that aren't part of a team, they've never set their own courses, never organised their personal training etc etc. Not only do they feel dejected but also they're thrown in at the deep end and only the most determined can progress through.
Andy
Posted: Mon Apr 24, 2006 9:29 am
by traveller
I believe that very few coaches and competitors will move permanently to Broxbourne. Apart from far higher house prices and worse congestion than Nottingham, it's not that far to travel daily. The fastest route, depending upon traffic, is 128 miles via the M1/M25 and the shortest 112 miles by A1(M)/A1198. Both routes, (and there are other permutations), at the right time are comfortably under 2 hours from Nottingham without breaking any speed limits, (I know, I do it several times a month for my sins). Factor in the costs of moving house, partners' jobs, schools, etc., and for the time the course is likely to be open, staying in Nottingham begins to look more and more attractive. Those at the sharp end for the 2012 Olympics may have to spend more time down there, but even this will only be short term and is unlikely to merit a permanent move.
The other question is what happens after the Olympics? A pumped course is not going to offer the 24/7 flexibility of HPP and many feel that economics will mean Broxbourne reduces its hours substantially, (especially for the higher flow Olympic course), or even closes altogether. In the emotion surrounding this topic don't forget that it's the bean counters who will decide its future, not paddlers, so until then it all depends on how much you, or if you're lucky World Class, are willing to pay to follow your dream. I just hope that the money doesn't all go towards relocating people who will probably have little to do afterwards, and so will need to be relocated again.
Posted: Mon Apr 24, 2006 9:37 am
by guest
Andy,
thanks for this, its good to know others have noticed the S & S attitude towards ohter paddlers.
Posted: Mon Apr 24, 2006 11:36 am
by guest
I read Ettiene's paper, I agree with Nick on the points he replied. Poor young juniors who want a challenge. Not regions have decent water to progress on.
Unfortunately the young paddlers are being told they need to be cut throay to get to the top. Not are JD (WC) paddlers are like that or want to be, they believe they can get to top and still be nice guys. Sportsmanship includes being supportive of your team amtes, not passing nasty comments. What happened to good old friendly rivalry???
Posted: Mon Apr 24, 2006 11:43 am
by guest
you have to ask is this coming from the paddlers, there parents or the coaches? it will always be a problem if only a few are sleected for all the coaching
Posted: Mon Apr 24, 2006 6:10 pm
by geust
It seems alot of people want something for nothing.
You dont need a WC coach and funding to achieve....i was funded and had support, then i slacked and lost it...i trained hard again without funding and managed to get it again.
It boils down to you cant please everyone or in this case fund everyone....thats life.
As for WC moving to broxbourne, the price to live there and the sorrounding are more than twice that of nottingham now, and are expected to more than double by the time everything for the olympics is built and finalised. Cost effective move? i dont think so.
Posted: Mon Apr 24, 2006 7:24 pm
by fison
i may be off the point as to the topic of course changes but if they or people move to broxbourne then what happens to Nottingham is it going to close. will this not also add more fule to the north south dived like With us in the North of Englad and not forgetting the Scots ( ps they have plenty of water) also if it is going to be pumped look at how much it will cost to run. Will the BCU and slalom people afford it as this should mean the end to the Neane help me out does any of my points make sence
where will the money come from and will they invest in any of the venues that are all ready up and running etc :p
Posted: Mon Apr 24, 2006 7:32 pm
by geust
nene is £70 - £80 an hour to pump.......broxbourne will be 5 times that to run....do the maths.....its going to be making a huge loss
Posted: Wed Apr 26, 2006 8:43 pm
by Shorty
Hi Andy G,
I am a stafford and stone junior and am quite shocked at what your coming out with. I quote:
Over the last twelve months i've watched the junior paddlers develop, many are now beating me, which is great. What i don't like is the way that many of them act. The continual nasty coments to other paddlers including those in their own group which aren't performing.
'nasty comments to other paddlers including those in their own group which are't performing.' As far as I'm aware, the other juniors that I train with at least, are all very supportive of eachother as we all work very hard to get where we are now.
Sorry to post something like this but felt that I needed to restore some dignity back for stafford and stone on behalf of us, the paddlers; the coachs and the parents who both put a lot of time into us voluntary. Thankyou to hose coaches, and parents.
Posted: Wed Apr 26, 2006 9:35 pm
by sscc junior
Well said shorty!
Posted: Wed Apr 26, 2006 11:47 pm
by Rachael
Yes I agree, but with the current climate of competition for JD I have seen some fairly poor behaviour from the junior paddlers towards each other, and I'm sorry to say that it was from the Stafford and Stone Club!
Posted: Thu Apr 27, 2006 1:20 am
by geust
competition is competition ....thats life